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-1 Rating Posted by: adriahna on 7/30/2003 5:24:00 PM

This coaster would earn such higher points if only SFGA would put some money into maintaining it - and possibly making some design improvements. I went to the park with a friend, who kept saying, "Youll love Rolling Thunder" - he knew I was a woodie fan. Having ridden pristine examples of woodies, I was hugely disappointed. This could be an awesome coaster - like I said, it just needs some help.

Help for the ride is on the way, here is a previous post I made (Im so lazy

The good news is, they are doing a lot of rehaul on the coaster (finally), the better news is, it has actually raced this year. Yes, on July 4th they opened the right side and raced it, until a mechanical failure on the right side closed it again. I am told that the right side has had massive track work done to it, at that now it is running better then ever. You had the missfortune of only riding on the left side, which has not had any work on it yet. As soon as they get the right side running with regularity, they are going to close the left side and do the work on that. I am looking forward to RT being back in the form it was 15 years ago (or better ).

That about sums it up. They repainted the ride in the off season, and they are doing the track work now. Since I made that post, they have been getting the right side running more regularly, so once it is 100%, I expect to see the left side shut down and retracked. I have not ridden it yet, but my understanding is the right side is running like glass now. I hope it is open on Friday, I go ofter and never catch it at the right time.

I was unable to ride this my last couple of visits (one time it was closed and the other I was with people that dont ride woodies), so I am kind of anticipating what it has in store. adriahna sums up basically what I have heard about the ride. I have been one to rip it pretty harshly, eventhough I have not ridden it yet - just by shear apperance, design and the fact that it is a racer that does not race. I am kind of looking forward to hopefully riding, maybe on opening day this year. And Cyclonic, you sound right on the money as usual.

I dont know how much they can help this coasater. They would be better of removign it and instaling two seporate woodies. one in the weatern are with the RT que areabuing used. the otehr in the back part of the ride usign the new area as its que entrance and location.

I disagree with mrceagle. RT is decent and is worth saving. It is hard to explain why SF doesnt maintain it better, but at least last years new paint helped some.

I agree the coaster badly neded the paint job. but Even at a faster speed and a brand new track system I dont see thsi coaster as beign that good. Ill have to reride it and see if there work has done any good.

There are people that love this coaster, and people that absolutely hate it -- just like anyother mediocare coaster out there. Im sure that a refirbishment of the ride would probably do wonders for it. Im not saying that it would be a great ride, but it would sure be a lot better than what it is, and that is basically all that you can really ask for from this park.

child could make it better then it is. The problem in SF has a big problem with doign things like this internaly and not contractign out to a conpany that knows how to do it right. it may be better but for how long. Pluse look at the fac tthat if they did remove it and instal 2 wood coaster in its place they are both goign to be far better then what they have now. they need a couple more wood coasters anyways.

some1 shod contracting out mrceagles speling, gramer and puctuatin;

Good point, papa. Anyhow, what Ive long been curious about, especially in this coasters case, is whether its costlier for a park to upgrade and maintain a wooden, vs. a steel. RT needs, and deserves, improvements - I think it could be a genuinely enjoyable coaster if GAdv would just invest some money into it. Whether or not they really care all that much is another matter...

That is pretty easy to see -- no they dont care about it. They just want to bring in the money. That is obviously why all businesses are in operation, but, at least a lot of places actually care about the product or service that they are selling. I think that it is most costly to upgrade and maintain a woodie than a steel. Actually, that is not necessarily true. It depends. If the wood coaster is designed correctly, put in a proper location and checked up on frequently like it should be and cared about, then there really shouldnt be that big of a deal money wise for it. Obviously there would be something of a cost, but not as much as something that is not taken care of and not properly or well designed. Sometimes it is in a parks better interest just to take the coaster down than to constantly have to maintain the ride (i.e. Hercules). However, unlike the ride Hercules, Rolling Thunders demise is not due to poor design or placement, but ignorant management that chooses to focus more on other things than maintainance.

Thank you for your question adriahna. Wood coasters are MUCH more expensive to maintain than steel ones. It costs MUCH less to maintain a coaster than to tear down and start over. That is why (with a few notable exceptions like Kings Dominion) large parks build many more steel coasters than wood ones and rarely take a wood coaster (which cost a lot to build) down. There is also little incentive to "upgrade" a wooden coaster beyond what normal maintenance requires, which might involve a retracking occasionally. Also, although there are obviously a lot of differences in wooden coasters, it is harder to "upgrade" a wooden coaster than a steel one, because the changes arent as straight forward, like replacing a loop on a steel coaster with a corkscrew element for instance. To give you a sense of the costs involved in designing and building a new wood coaster, in the 1980s the "Giant Coaster" at Paragon Park in Massachusetts was dismantled and rebuilt at Wildworld (now SF America) in Maryland for about $1 million dollars. The cost of a new wood coaster at Wild World would have been about $5 million. With this kind of difference, parks definately want to keep the old woodies running.

To put in my two cents on this, I think SF Great Adventure should just keep running the RT as is, but give it more TLC than they gave it in the past. It would also be good if they raced it more often.

First off, the park in Maryland is Six Flags America, not Great America. Second, they cant run a racer like this. It looks bad on the park, and that is the last thing that they need... another thing to make them look bad. They are putting in a whole new area to the park, and the worlds tallest and fastest roller coaster. This sends up two things with me. 1. They are putting in a multi million dollar coaster and little world, and cant even take the time to fix up and make what they already have acceptable. and 2. The fact that Rolling Thunder, not to mention many other rides in the park, are not up to par or in some cases not running at all, makes the park look bad to those new visitors that are going to see Kingda Ka and are at Great Adventure for the first time. What a great first impression. It is just me and it might be a little nit picky, but my home park, Dorney Park, is getting Hydra: The Revenge, and I just want the park to look its best for those who are going to be there for the first time (like BobFunland)-- and I just think that Steel Force needs a paint job. Small. Yes. But I just want the park to look its best. I guess Six Flags doesnt care about that. If this whole addition to Great Adventure actually works out well, then good for them. But after this season they need to soley place their efforts on what they already have and have had for a while in order to make their park better. It is not necessarily addition by subtraction, just addition through constance. Keep the same things and make them work, and take out inoperational flats and put in different ones.

By the way, I didnt completely understand your reasoning in describing the cost thing with the woods and the steels. It kind of sounded like you contradicted yourself in there somewhere. That might have just been me though. I didnt really get in.

Im with you on GAdv, Hercules - I wish the park would just get what they have in order - if they did, Id be willing to go back. It was a disaster both times I went (summer of 2003) - just a mess of filth and downed rides - both flats and coasters.

I see what youre talking about, papa - considering all of the prefabricated parts that go into the vast majority of steelies (if not all), it makes perfect sense that woodies would be much more expensive to build and maintain.

For those who didnt ride it 15-20 years ago Rolling Thunder used to be a good ride, if PKD can still maintain and run Rebel Yell there is no reason this cant be run properly. As far as ripping it down and putting in two wood coasters. Why? Then SFGAdv would just have two poorly maintained woodies.

Excellent points on the two wooden coasters larrygator. I really dont see why they cant just get their act together. They have problems with Viper, Rolling Thunder and The Chiller ALL of the time. It is absolutely absurd and rediculous. And their flats are usually a mess. I was obviously not one who road it back in the day, but I can see that is was probably a good ride just from photos of it and I cant understand why a place would do something like that to one of their rides. A funny story about Great Adventure and their maintanence. I was on gadv.com, the unofficial site of Great Adventure, and there was actually someone who was praising the Six Flags maintainence. They said something like "I was there in May and Chiller wasnt running and it was not running throughout all of the summer at all, but they got it up and running for Fright Fest! Good job guys! I think their maintanance is great!" What a joke. And then there are always the ones that think it is a feat that they still at least have one side of Rolling Thunder. Give me a break. They need to open up their eyes and realize that their home park is a dump. They need to go to a real park and see the coasters that have been up for twice as long as that ride, and in the same condition that they were in when they were constructed. Like I have said and will say again, Rolling Thunder is a racer that doesnt race. Enough said.

I remember in the late 80s at night getting off RT with about 50 others and running back through the queue and waiting one ride max as they had two train operations on both tracks. Now 50 people on the queue can equate to a 20-25 minute wait, with one train operations, on one side, and extremely slow ride ops. You used to be able to get 4-5 rides in over 20-25 minutes.

Everybody is always piling on Rolling Thunder, but as larrygator said, it was a good ride in its day. The problem is Six Flags and its neglect, not RT. Great Adventure used to not only race the trains but run one forward and one backward. It was was the parks showcase ride in the 80s until the Great American Scream Machine came along. Herc makes an interesting point about the attention Kingda Ka will bring to the park. In the best of worlds, the arrival of Kingda Ka at Great Adventure would be like the arrival of the Super Bowl, which means roads get repaved, trash gets picked up, trees get planted, and in general the entire infrastructure revs itself up to full capacity. If Detroit (which is to urban areas what Great Adventure is to themeparks) can doll itself up for the Super Bowl, Great Adventure can get its act to together for the worldwide attention a record-breaking coaster will bring. If Great Adventure throws everything into the new Kingda Ka section and continues to let the rest of the park rot, people will come once out of curiosity but then stay away out of disgust.

I remember when Rolling Thunder was the showcase ride in the 80s. I may have been young but I remember watching the commercials for the park in my Northeast Pennsylvania home while lying happily on the floor, watching the television with my family. I would see Rolling Thunder, with two trains going down the first drop, one forwards and one backwards. That is one of the images that truely stands out from my childhood in regards to the park. Going by those childhood memories, I was quite excited to get to the park, but was never able to, until 4 years ago. Talk about repulsive. Rides were down, landscape made me want to puke, and the staff was lackluster to say the least. And to top that off, one ride that was down - Rolling Thunder. To tell you the truth, I really hope that Six Flags can get their act together. The place really has a lot of potential, but it is really hard to picture and it is really sad. I was one that came with curiosity but then left with disgust. I will be curious again on opening day and then later in the season to see Kingda Ka, but I just hope that I dont have to stay away forever due to an emense amount of disgust. Right now I plead with Six Flags Great Adventure to make things better, not just for me, not just for the rest of the park enthusiasts, not just for the general public, but for yourselfs. Because eventually you will see a lack of people in attendance, which will mean and loss of money. So just remember that loss of money that you will eventually see... because that IS all that you really care about, isnt it?

I have heard deforent returns on how much it tacks to maitain a Wood vs Steel coaster. I have heard more often that Steels coast more to maitain. were track and suport can wear faster on a wood. Wheels and axles wear faster on a steel. you dont often chance a wheel on a wood coasater. most wheels will only last a year to two years on a steel. I understand that if they added two coaster over RT they stand the chance of neglecting it like they tend to do in the SF world. Its jsut the coaster never runs two train, its design isnt that great. and paintign is great but the track needs total replacment. the trains also need allot of work.

Ok Hercules, I fixed Six Flags Americas park name in my earlier comment. The Park was called Adventure World the last time I went there, after having been once called Wild World so cut me some slack if I didnt keep the new name straight. My comment didnt contradicted itself on cost. Adriahna had asked which costs more to upgrade: a woodie or a steel. I answered in two parts: First, woodies cost more than steelies to build in the first place and second, woodies cost more to upgrade. I also believe that SF will not tear down RT and replace it with a new woodie because that would cost too much. Both tracks on RT are operational, so the only reason not to "race" RT would be economic (needing to pay two track crews) and general laziness. Indeed, on Saturdays they often run both sides without racing, which seems just lazy to me. I dont accept that they shouldnt race RT after Kinga Ka opens because it would somehow look bad. After the recent repaint, RT looks presentable enough. Finally, SF announced last year that they were embarking on a multi-year project to "beautify" the park. Some stuff did get done last year, such as new landscaping and new paint on RT and Batman. Lets hope they follow through with more fix-ups this year.

I would think that on Saturdays, the reason that they dont run both sides may be to get the trains in and out as fast as possible, to keep the lines moving on the busiest day of the week. Just my guess though...

unfortunately RT tends to have the worst and slowest ride ops of all the SFGAdv coasters. They tend to stand around and talk to themselves and guests until someone reminds them to go check that the restraints are locked.

There are alot of insider problems that most people dont know about when it comes to SFGAdv. The parks maintaince crew is unionized, and the workers dont like working on wooden coasters. Simple as that. It is not that SFGAdv doesnt want to improve RT, it is they cant, because right now they cant do a thing about the union. This is also why they, for the moment, wont put another wooden coaster in.

If you want to bash a company about their wooden coasters, I would look at Cedar Faire instead, for the most part, SFI takes care of their woodies pretty well (and I have ridden a bunch of them).

perhaps when you leave the northeast that is true but not up here. Thunderbolt is ok, Cyclone has been distyroyed and RT is terable. just to name a few. Ive heard bad things aobut The wood coaster Predator At SFDL also. The only well maintained coaster is Comet and there not a flaged park.

The Riverview Cyclone is just plain a bad design, and it rips itself apart. Thunderbolt is what it is, a smaller, tamer coaster, but it is well maintained and tracks very well. The Comet, as you said is excellent. Predator runs those horrible trailored PTCs, which never worked well, and tear apart track. Wild One and Roar at SFA are both is great shape year after year. The wood at SFKK were both pretty good, and tracked well.

On the other hand, nobody would miss Mean Streak if it came down, and very few miss Hercules. But that too, they are both poor designs, so lets talk about a proven design, Thunderhawk. It was a top ten ride until Cedar Faire took over. They neutered it, adding trims, changing the station, removing the tunnel, changing the trains, and now it is nothing like its past glory, and all so they can save a few bucks maintaining it. I have been hearing bad things about Shivering Timbers as well, that it is in need of track work that is not getting done, and the same for Ghost Rider, but I have not ridden either, so I cant say from experience.

Back to RT, what it really needs is work on the trains. Maybe not replacement, but at least a rehad and changing the seats from that hard styrofoam seating to the softer, plusher vinyl seat pads. I think this would dramatically change the ride by taking away the back jaring that you get from it, and well as being able to fit you a little better. Problem is, from my understanding from someone more inside then me, they cannot send the trains out to be rehabed due to the union, and they cannot afford right now to totally replace the trains (at a cost of about 40k per train).

Lets talk more about Thunderhawk. That is number two on my list for missing what used to be. The tunnel made that ride. That is what it was and what it was known for. The change of the station was completely unneeded. The trims will give you a neck ache and ruin the next hour that you are in the park. It used to be something. But hey, Im all about safety, right? Well screw that on that ride. It used to be something. Why did they have to take that tunnel out? Stupid.

Back to Rolling Thunder. It needs all the help it can get. You name it, they should try it. No holding back.

The station I can understand. The thing was a deathtrap. BUT, they could have built a new station that had the flavor of the old. They could have kept Alfunzo. They could have kept the Skooters and JttCotE. They could have kept the circle swing and boats for that matter. Instead, not only did they steal the life from the coaster, they stole the heart of the entire park.

Very well stated. They did steal the heart of the park. It is not the park that it once was in any way. Remeber those boats when they first got them though? Oh man, the first year that I saw them, those things had enough power to literally throw people out. That was great. And the Skooters... that is another story. The crap of an excuse for bumper cars they have now is disgusting. They could have kept a lot of things. I still call Dorney Park my home park, but it is not the same park that I fell in love with.

I wasnt meaning the power boats, but the little boats that ran in the lake (which is now just a swamp) in the center of the park. But the power boats were cool too.

Sad to say, the Comet has apparently undergone substantial reprofiling in the last year, and although I havent ridden it since, I hear the measures were all designed to make it tamer and more "family-friendly." If ever a roller coaster did not need reprofiling, the Comet was it. This and other infamies have earned the Six Flags chain as a whole a well-deserved reputation for neglecting and/or maiming otherwise execellent wooden roller coasters. Nevertheless, Cyclonic has a valid point. Certain individual parks do a good job. The last time I visited SF American (2002), both Wild One and Roar were running very well, and BobFunland tells me the Great American Scream Machine is still well-maintained at SFOG. I also agree that Cedar Fair cant be trusted to do any better. Blue Streak runs pretty well but it has those stupid seat dividers and headrests. Mean Streak, however, is just sad, and Thunderhawk obviously hasnt benefitted from the change in management.

The reprofile of the Comet has been blown WAY out of proportion. I rode it last season after the first set of turns were reprofiled, and the differences are minor. The train travels through the dogleg turns a little more smoothly, but still gives you a good lateral jolt.

This brings up another peeve of mine, the enthusiests who are totally opposed to change, even if it is for the better. I was VERY dissappointed in ACE when they published and article decring these changes, and to make it worse they erged members to write the park and complain about them, when most of the members, and many of ACE uppers for that matter, had not even been on the coaster since the change. Even more frustrating was a diatride about the changes given by a NYCC member at an event at Lake Compounce, a day after Great Escape had given us two full hours ERT on the Comet. I was on the verge of walking out, as were others. These people unfairly bash parks for things that sometimes must be done to maintain the bottom line. After all, if the park cant do that, then why be in business.

The Comet reprofilign has definatly been blown out of proportion. I agree that the turn are better now and ofe rthe same wild ride without the back ach. the second part is smothign out htat smaller hill on the return trip. that has always been a bad pat of the ride and shoudl be peter for it.

The Yankee Cannonball at Canobie Lake Park is also getign reprofiled this year. at this moment the intire back turn is down and beginign toi be rebuilt. they are anglign the turn 36 degrees. this was always a bad part of the coaster and this is a good move. thsi is also closer to the oricanal disign. that turn has setled over the years.

I understand that when it comes to business these comapnies are working to make money. CP and SF have cone out of there way to make the coaster run cheaper. Its a bad way to look at things.

also that Union at SFGAdv needs to badly look at what they can handle and what they cant. those trains need to be fixed and fixed right. if they cant send them out, some of them need to go and get sertifide to fix the trains. Why not Canobies minatince has 2 guys trained by PTC.

I wont deny that Im a crank when it comes to change and that I always assume the worst (especially when SF is behind the change). However, I can be fair-minded when the change really is "for the better" (which is almost always an arguable concept, anyway). Phantoms Revenge is in my top ten, even though its a reprofiled Steel Phantom, and I think you can make a good case that Phantoms Revenge is the better coaster. Again, Cyclonic makes a valid point. Every park has to worry about the bottom line, and if they didnt, we wouldnt have any roller coasters. And even a boring, neutered roller coaster is better than no roller coaster (maybe). Nevertheless, some parks (like Knoebels and Kennywood) still manage to rise above the fray and deliver uncompromising rides while still remaining profitable. No doubt, the bottom line increasingly abhors the rough and ready wooden roller coasters, but Im an enthusiast, not a businessman, and business decisions that tame perfectly tolerable levels of intensity (as on the Comet) will never be popular with me.

And this brings us to the question; what is a tolerable level of intensity? While many of us prefer the hard hitting, intense ride, these days the general public does not. While the intensity is just what the teenagers visiting Coney Island want, the families visiting The Great Escape while on vacation probably dont want that, they want a tamer ride, one that is fun but does not beat the snot out of them. The Great Escape is in a touristy area, and as such mostly caters to families. I have to assume, having no personal knowege, that they GE was getting complaints about the ride on their serveys, and that maybe ridership had declined. The park wants to, no needs to, make their customers happy.

As you know, you cant always make everyone happy all the time. Take for instance the Super Bowl halftime show this year, with Paul McCartney. Dont you know the FCC still got complaints on it. Some people werent happy because they thought is was boring, others because a song he did refranced drugs. Personally, I thought it was the best show in many, many years (so was the game). Some folks can never be satisfied. The same goes with roller coasters, so the park has to go with the majority.

As for Knoebels and Kennywood, they are local parks, people there know what to expect, and that is what they want. Besides, aside from Thunderbolt, which will kick your ass, none of the coasters at those parks are particulaly intense, and they are still all great rides (even the HSTC).

I honestly wouldnt have thought the Comet would have rated particularly rough even to the general public. I found it extremely "rideable" in every seat. Pheonix and Twister, for example, both seemed more boisterous to me than the Comet. Im never surprised (although always disgusted) when rides like Rattler, Texas Cyclone, and Thunderhawk get reprofiled, but I am at a lost to see how anyone who would get on a roller coaster in the first place would think the Comet was too rough or too intense. If Dragon Coaster at Rye Playland is a one on the roughness scale and Son of Beast is a ten, then I would rate the Comet, at most, a five or six (and only then for the laterals).

The other thing tolook at is origanal disign. many older coasters liek The YAnkee Cannonball have setled over theyear. most of what they are doing is returnign it to its oricanal shap. that is what was done one the Comets turn. that last run will have to see. The big thing toremember is its the very end of the coaster so the majority of the ride is the same.

Some times work needs to be done. but its when its just for cost and lasyness like the Riverside Cyclone were we shoudlbe speakign out.

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